The Rose: "The Bachelor" (and CBRE's) Matt James on CRE & Reality TV

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Spencer Levy
We've had many real estate stars on this show, but none quite like our upcoming guest. On this episode we welcome a former football player who's now an associate in CBRE’s New York office. Oh, yeah, he's also The Bachelor.

Matt James
You know, there's a lot of funny things that people did that came with props that came in pickup trucks that came in, pizza delivery cars.

Spencer Levy
That's none other than Matt James, star of the hit ABC reality show, joining us from Jupiter, Florida, during a break in production.

Matt James
You know, there's so many amazing, incredible women and stories that you're hearing that it's really there is no right decision. You know, it's like it's like how do you really get to know somebody in that first evening and you just try to use your best judgment? And that's what I did. You know, it was hard.

Spencer Levy
It's a conversation we recorded in late January, a little more than a month before The Bachelor finale, we talked about the show, The Bachelorettes, some of my favorite moments from season 25. Matt also opened up about his professional journey as he made his way from the football field to the arena of real estate, literally after a bus ride to New York City. We talked about diversity, inclusion and even more important, accountability in our industry. We talked about career building, including some interesting advice on how to harness the power of social media. We even took our first ever fan questions here on the show. OK, they're from Bachelor fans, but who's counting? Spoiler alert. There will be no roses given out, but there will be no spoilers about Matt’s show either. Just a breezy, revealing conversation with a smart, charismatic real estate professional. The Bachelor, he's here right now on The Weekly Take.

Welcome to The Weekly Take, and this week on The Weekly Take, we are delighted to be joined by our friend and colleague, Matt James. Matt James, The Bachelor on The Bachelor. Matt, thank you for joining us today.

Matt James
Thanks for having me. Spencer, I've been looking forward to this. I appreciate you taking the time.

Spencer Levy 
Well, Matt, as an introduction, you should know that I've met a few celebrities in my life. I've met Adam Sandler, David Copperfield, Mike Tyson, and now you, who I also know from years back working with us. But you were on Good Morning America, Jimmy Kimmel and now The Weekly Take. It's the same experience, right?

Matt James
It's a steep decline in guests. I apologize for that. Sorry about that.

Spencer Levy 
You're going to rock the house today, but it's not only a coincidence that we work together at CBRE and we were in the same group research for several years. And wasn't it the piece of advice I'd given you say what's the best career advice you can give me, Matt? I said, well, why don't you appear on America's most popular reality show and be the star? So that was clearly good advice.

Matt James
Yeah, no, I figured that that role in research would eventually lead me to this position as well. So you're one for one so far.

Spencer Levy 
There we go. Matt, bottom line is, you should also know you probably remember, Matt, for some of my presentations. I also was on a well, I guess an old school version of a reality show, The Price is Right, a tape which everybody in the company has seen. So I have not only advice on career and otherwise, but also game show technique or reality show technique.

Matt James
I could have used that before I walked into there you know, I was a little caught off guard. But we could connect on that after this.

Spencer Levy 
I'm sure this isn't going to be your first reality show experience. So maybe it'll help you on the next one. But you're doing great. Now, speaking of doing great, now, let's talk about The Bachelor. Walk us through your journey. How did you get on the show?

Matt James
That's a great question. My former college teammate and one of my best friends, Tyler Cameron, who's also my roommate now, he was on The Bachelorette when Hannah Brown was The Bachelorette and his mom actually nominated me. You know, she saw how big of an influence it was in his life and the man that she wanted him to become, and she actually passed away last year. So it was kind of to honor her memory and just to see it out for her.

Spencer Levy 
Sorry to hear about Tyler's mom, but that's a terrific story. And I also know, speaking of moms, I know you're very close to your own mom, and she was a huge influence on your life as well. Isn’t that correct?

Matt James
She was you know, she's wanted to be a grandma, since I can remember. So this process was going to bring her closer to having that take place. So she's been the biggest advocate in terms of making this all possible. So I'm excited that I saw it through for her as well.

Spencer Levy 
That's awesome. And I do note that some of these questions came in today from your former colleagues in research, including Marissa Oberlander in The Bachelor Watch Club in Chicago. So that's where I got all my good intel. But tell us a little bit more about your relationship with Tyler. How did you get to meet him and, you know, being roommates and stuff?

Spencer Levy 
Oh, my gosh, Tyler, the first time I met Tyler was my his freshman year college at Wake Forest my sophomore year, because I was a year older than him and he graduated high school early and he gray shirted, which means he was coming in a semester early to try to win that starting quarterback position. And I met him outside as freshman dorm. And it was a Friday. I just got out of class. I never met the guy. Hey, what's up? My name's Matt. I'm one of your receivers. Look, I know that this is a shot in the dark, but a bunch of the receivers are driving down the University of South Carolina for the weekend. Would you want to join us? He went inside again he doesn't know who I am. I could be anybody. I could have made this up. He's like, all right. Yeah, sure, I'm in. Drops his bags off. He gets in our Jeep. We had one of the best weekends of our entire college. Everything was downhill from there. But that moment we formed the friendship that has carried on ten plus years later.

Spencer Levy 
Obviously, you're standing on the shoulders of a lot of great relationships with Tyler, with your mom, with Tyler's mom, giving you some inspiration, but also your football experience.

Spencer Levy 
Tell us a little bit more about your football experience at Wake, how that has sort of molded you into who you are today?

Matt James
Well, I would say football or lack of football experience at Wake Forest. You know, I really didn't see the field until I was a senior. And I made Tyler's job very difficult, not having the best hands. So me and Tyler spent a bunch of time together on the sidelines as well as, you know, off the field. So we had a lot of time to cultivate that relationship. But it was it was fun because you're just exposed to competition at the highest level. And a lot of those lessons and experiences I took with me the professional world, you know, you're getting chewed out by your coaches, you're getting beat up by the other team. And that kind of prepares you for what to expect in the working world and how to take critique, how to respond to adversity and things that I'll never, never forget and I'll be forever grateful for.

Spencer Levy 
You know, and I think, you know, it's interesting because I did a little bit more about your back story about how you became The Bachelor. You gave part of that story. But I think also part of the stories that you were supposed to be a bachelor on The Bachelorette, but because of COVID, that kind of fell through. Is it fair to say that the adversity or the level of adversity you face in football made you tougher? The fact that there were some adversity that didn't get on the show, it actually worked out in the end.

Matt James
You know, I couldn't put it better. Spencer, there's so many times in football where you're discouraged, whether it's an injury, whether it's running the wrong route, dropping the game winning pass, there's a million things that go wrong in the game and they just prepare you physically and mentally for all those obstacles that you're going to face as a professional in the working world. And, you know, we saw that I saw that personally with The Bachelorette. I was supposed to be a contestant on Clare Crawley’s season and the world seemingly shut down that second week in March of 2020. And I flew down to Jupiter, Florida. Three months later, the opportunity presents itself to be The Bachelor. And here I am.

Spencer Levy 
Well, I think it's fair to say there's a great expression. When life gives you lemons you make lemonade and boy, did you make some lemonade this year. That's wonderful. But in addition to your Wake football experience, you also got a cup of coffee on a few practice squads in the NFL. Tell us a little bit about that.

Matt James
Man that that just affirmed that I wasn't ready. You know, like when you're around elite athletes like that who know how to respond to the toughest of situations and are resilient and know how to take critique, I just wasn't ready. You know, you've got top talent coming out every single year from college. You got the best freshmen coming in and you've got guys who are trying to come to the NFL from Canada. You've got every cast and character. And it was a great experience, but it was enough to show me that. I was fortunate enough to be able to go to Wake and has such a great education and internship opportunities so that that next phase of my life was going to be seamless. You know, that transition from the football world into the working world wasn't as stressful as you would imagine just because of the work that I put it in college and the relationships I had formed professionally.

Spencer Levy 
Yeah, well, once again, it's turning lemons into lemonade, though it probably was pretty cool to meet Cam Newton and the Carolina Panthers folks while you were there.

Matt James
Yeah, when you see those guys up close, it's just a different beast. You know, Cam Newton's probably 10 feet tall. You know, he looks like he's everyone kind of looks the same out there on TV. But when you get in the locker room, when you're with these guys at practice, it really puts things into perspective. Same with Drew Brees. I grew up watching him play. And to have that be someone who's throwing the balls in practice is just it just blows my mind. So, again, an experience I'll never forget.

Spencer Levy 
Fantastic. Well, given your football experience, we're getting the Super Bowl pick. Any thoughts on the big game?

Matt James
Absolutely. You know, this is going to be a hot take. I know there's a hot tip because I can see both sides of the coin. I could see people who wouldn't dare to bet against Brady. He's 60 percent in the Super Bowl he has won six of 10. But at the same time, aside from maybe Russell Wilson and Aaron Rodgers, Patrick Mahomes is the best quarterback in football right now and that they've got so much offensive firepower. Andy Reid, super creative. Their defense is firing. I've got to go, KC. I'm betting against the goat and I'm going to Kansas City.

Spencer Levy 
Betting against the goat. OK, well, we'll see. And I note that I agree with your assessment of the game. I got a lot of friends in Boston. I like to give them a little bit of grief about what's going on in the Super Bowl to my friends in Boston. But Mahomes is a cut above, maybe a cut above Lamar Jackson, who I note happens to be my neighbor here in Baltimore. And I'm a huge Lamar fan. But Patrick Mahomes has proven it on the field. And I'm going with your pick as well.

Matt James
I will not stand for any Patriots fans pulling for the Buccaneers. Y'all are not Buccaneers fans. Your allegiance and alliance stays in New England. You will not get support for Tampa Bay.

Spencer Levy 
Wow. Well, I grew up a Jets fan, and I'm root for Brady, too, so I had 50 years of pain there. But I love your comment on Boston. You know, you had your chance. My friends in Boston are going to love that. OK, so let's turn now to the show, Matt, so you started with 32 different young women. 32 is a lot of people to remember. So let's start with a very simple question. How do you remember all the names of the contestants on the show?

Matt James
That's actually a great question. So for better for worse, you kind of start to associate what they did in their entrance with name recognition. So one of the women came with goat hooves over her heels and like, oh, that's goat feet. That's Saneh, you know, so like just by association of what they were, how they present it and what they talked about. Oh, that's the woman that fed me a meatball. So like, I was trying to find a different word association to make sure that I didn't forget. And it was actually easier than you would have expected because you're so locked and you don't have your phone, you don't have a meeting to run to an email to respond to. You're just there and you're extremely present. And you didn't forget any names. Luckily.

Spencer Levy 
That's excellent. So remembering this is a quasi-family show. Tell us what your favorite entrance was and if it's something that might not fit on a family show, maybe tell us what the second favorite entrance was. And this comes directly from our Chicago fans.

Matt James
Keeping in mind that this is a family show. I would have to say that my favorite entrance was Bri, because Bri gave such a meaningful message when she came up to me. You know, there's a lot of funny things that people did. They came with props. They came in pickup trucks. They came in pizza delivery cars. But Bri just delivered this meaningful message about why she was happy that I was here and what she was looking to find here and that that resonated with me. So she stuck out to me day one.

Spencer Levy 
Well, that's excellent. And I would define that in terms of keeping it real and keeping it real goes a long way.

Matt James
She kept it real.

Spencer Levy 
Speaking of real, there are also some real characters on the show. And I did watch the episode on Monday with my 11-year-old daughter. Victoria may have certainly distinguished herself. We have a former Miss Puerto Rico. We have a teacher from Minnesota, Michelle, who, by the way, may be my favorite character on the show, but I do have a bone to pick with you. Emani was the only realtor on the show and you let her go on week one, why not some love for commercial real estate?

Matt James
You know, there's so many amazing, incredible women and stories that you're hearing that it's really there is no right decision. You know, it's like it's like how do you really get to know somebody in that first evening and you just try to use your best judgment? And that's what I did. You know, it was hard.

Spencer Levy 
Well, I'm sure there are no easy choices, probably no wrong choices to make on that show either. So let me just ask you a spoiler question, not the spoiler spoiler, but how do you deal with that? People are asking you all the time what's going to happen. Who's going to win, who's your favorite, how do you deal with the balancing being colorful with I can't tell you anything.

Matt James
Right? I try to say as much as I can without giving anything away because it was such an incredible experience. And there's so much to be highlighted about what I learned about these women and just everything about myself through this whole process. But I just I just recall the fonder, the memories. I just talk about group dates. I talk about the one on ones. I give some of the behind-the-scenes stuff that they may not know or have heard about. And I just try to highlight those things and they kind of serve as a smoke and mirrors around the question that everyone wants to know. So that's been a good strategy for me so far.

Spencer Levy 
If I could give you a few more comments from my Chicago Bachelor watching team, just one piece of advice from them, they said if everything's on the table, ask Matt this question. Matt, do you realize that you kiss with your eyes wide open?

Matt James
Oh, my gosh. I knew this was coming. Listen, Spencer, listen. I've never had someone record me kissing someone before, so I didn't even know it was news to me that my eyes were open. So I'm watching this back and I'm just like, oh, my gosh. And obviously it's already happened. So, like, everyone's like, you got to start kissing with your eyes because I'm like, listen, you in for a long season because my eyes are closed at the same time, having my eyes open, I feel like I'm able to protect her, you know, like someone could sneak up on you in that vulnerable moment. So I got to make sure that it's for both of our best interests, that I keep my eyes open and peeled for anything dangerous that would be happening.

Spencer Levy 
So a couple more things and just some unsolicited advice from our Chicago team. Their favorite contestants in order are Abigail, Bri, Michelle, and I'm looking at your face, not quite putting on your game face to not giving anything away there. I say my personal favorite is Michelle, the teacher from Minnesota. I think she was great. And by the way, I really like the green balloon you took her up in on this week's episode. Was that in in light of your CBRE roots.

Matt James
Spencer, I don't know if you've ever been up in a hot air balloon, but my head was so close to that flame I thought that my hair was on fire. It was so hot in that thing. But unbelievable view because it's a 360 panorama and you could see everything. Definitely something I want to do again.

Spencer Levy 
Absolutely. Absolutely. You know, it's interesting because some of the prior shows of The Bachelor is Bachelor in Paradise go to these exotic locations. But Nemacolin Falls, a beautiful place. I've been there in the summertime, never in the fall.

Matt James
Spencer I before I moved to New York, I lived in Pittsburgh. So I really felt like I was back home. It's like an hour from the city and the people there just Southern PA, just good salt of the earth people, the scenery. During that time, the leaves were changing. The weather was you could wear a hoodie, you could wear shorts like that. It's just the perfect mixture in the perfect setting to fall in love. So I really enjoyed it.

Spencer Levy 
So Matt, let's now turn a little bit to some real estate professional type topics. We're so proud of you for a lot of reasons or maybe a little bit more proud because you were the first African-American bachelor on the show, trailblazer. So what are your thoughts on that?

Matt James
Yeah, thank you, Spencer. You know, it's an honor and I feel like they're big shoes to fill because any time you're the first of anything, there's going to be a magnifying glass and there's going to be an extra level of scrutiny. So initially, I put a lot of pressure on myself to speak for a group of people that I really wasn't qualified to speak for. You know, I can only speak on behalf of my experiences and how I was raised. And that's what I tried to do and how I tried to come across through the way I represented myself on the show and handled adversity and tough conversations that come up and that will come up during this experience. But I'm hoping that this type of experience is normalized for people who look like me and that it's the first of many and it's a step in the right direction.

Spencer Levy 
The commercial real estate industry is working very hard, especially CBRE and others, to add more diversity, more African-Americans, more other minorities. Has your experience on the show in any way transferable to our industry? Anything you could say that what we should be doing differently?

Matt James
You know, I think is just being intentional with what you're trying to do. You know, I think that you have to seek to make a difference and make a change. And it's not always going to be like the applicant pool may be less of what you're looking for. You have to go out and pursue these people that you're looking for because they may not know they're qualified. There may not be representation in their community about what's going on. And from my experience, I've seen that you all have done an incredible job. I was part of a team that went and spoke at HBCU’s about what it was like working at CBRE. And those are the type steps that you have to take to make sure that everyone's going to have a seat at the table. And CBRE is doing a great job with that.

Spencer Levy 
Well, I'm glad you mentioned that because we are making a major push now into historically black colleges and universities. I've been part of a lot of it. But you use the key word. The key word is intentional. Our chief diversity officer, Tim Dismond was on this podcast by the way. We did have Tim on this podcast, and he was great. He would use the word accountability.

Tim Dismond
Measuring results and being accountable for delivering on those results is critical to our success. Real impact includes increasing the number of diverse hires across all business segments and at all levels of our company, including senior leadership positions. It also includes a heavy emphasis on mentoring and upskilling our diverse employees and ensuring that they have a clear path to succession and development at CBRE. And finally, it also requires continually monitoring and improving our culture to make sure that D&I initiatives are embraced by the entire organization. All of these initiatives will use similar tools of accountability that we use for our broader organizational success.

Spencer Levy 
And wouldn't you say that accountability is a word that not only applies to our business, but probably applies to your background in football accountability? Is everything there?

Matt James
Yeah, accountability is tough because it puts you in a position to be scrutinized. And when you take accountability for something that's extremely powerful for both sides because you're recognizing a problem and generally you're coming with a solution, you're like, you know, I'm taking accountability for this, CBRE’s like, you know, we're taking accountability for this. We don't see a lot of representation in the areas that we'd like to see. And to that point, in fact, we're going to go out and we're going to seek that type of talent, whether that means we're going to HBCU’s, whether that means being part of other professional organizations that seek to place people of color. It's taking those intentional steps. And that's why I'm proud to be at CBRE because of the intentionality behind a lot of what you all are doing.

Spencer Levy 
I agree. And I would also note that that intentionality doesn't just start at the college level. It starts before. And I know your passion for teaching younger kids through ABC Food Tours. How did you get into it and why it's important to you?

Matt James
Yeah, and that's incredible, Spencer. Especially having a lot of friends and teammates from Baltimore. I know that that's an area that needs as many resources as possible. So kudos to you for that and continued to work. In terms of ABC Food Tours it was something that really started at Wake Forest. You know, there was one of my favorite programs when I was playing football at Wake Forest was a program we had called Eat with the Deacs, where we would bus students in from lower income areas around Winston-Salem to have this incredible experience. For a day. They'd tour the facilities. They go to practice with us. We take them to class study hall, and then we share a meal with them. And when we're having this meal, they're sharing their hopes, their dreams, their aspirations. And I'm listening. And I'm like, these kids aren't much different than myself. Like, the only thing that separated them from where I'm at is opportunity. And a lot of that came from economics. And when I graduated and I didn't have that platform as a football player anymore, I'm like, how do we reach these students? And I paired two of my favorite things, which was food and fitness. And we started working with students in the Lower East Side who were in the same targeted lower income areas that wouldn't have the experiences that I had and that we were privy to based on again an economic situation. So it's been one of the most meaningful projects I've been involved with. And quarantine and the COVID has thrown a wrench into how we can traditionally work with these students. But we've gotten creative with our virtual programing and how we plan on moving forward.

Spencer Levy 
Well, that's great. Let's turn now to commercial real estate. And so you have been in the business now in a variety of capacities for years, not just at CBRE. Tell us how you chose commercial real estate.

Matt James
So when I finished playing football, I moved to Pittsburgh and I worked for PNC Bank and I went through their CNIB development program where I learned how to underwrite, you're in a sales rotation, you're in a Treasury rotation. You learn everything, the ins and outs of the bank. And that structure and that discipline was major because it was it was a seamless transition from football. I took a trip to New York and I think I stayed up for 72 hours, I didn't sleep, I was fascinated, I never been before, and it was a six hour bus ride from Pittsburgh. And I just continued to take these trips every weekend. Three months later, I moved up there and I took a job working at a startup. And about three months into working at the startup, I'm just like. That structure that I crave and I need as a former athlete, as someone who needs to have a regimented schedule, a hierarchy, there wasn't a lot of that in that start up environment. And I was at a place in my professional career where I'm like, all right, what's going to be my next move? Real estate's always been a major part of our family. My mom works in new home sales. My aunt has a brokerage shop in Virginia and my cousin is a developer in Raleigh. And so it's not something I've never considered. And one of my good friends, dads, Steve Swerdlow, who just stepped away from the company, I was having a conversation with him about where I was in my career. And he's like, you know, if you ever wanted to work in commercial real estate, let me know. And that turned into a longer conversation where I took my first role in research and spent a year and a half in research and then transitioned into brokerage.

Spencer Levy 
Well, you know, it's funny, I knew we had coincidences because of The Price is Right and The Bachelor. Now we have yet another one because you know who gave me my big break professionally?

Matt James
It was not Steve Swerdlow.

Spencer Levy 
It was Steve Swerdlow. So it has been a great launching ground, not only for you, but for me and through Steve. But, you know, it also speaks to the fact that there's opportunities that are presented to you from childhood with great parenting, with money, with other things like that. But everybody needs mentoring and needs a break once in a while.

Matt James
Yeah, 100 percent. It's so important because there hasn't been a time where I've reached out to someone where they've said no. Anyone I've talked to in the companies taken a second. It might it might have taken a minute to get a hold of them, but they've never turned me down. And that's the type of culture that I want to continue to be a part of.

Spencer Levy 
Great. That's great. You now have more tools in your toolbox and the tools in your toolbox aren't just the fact you got famous on the show, but social media, social media is an area where, you know, I'm proud of my LinkedIn following. I have eighteen thousand followers. I feel awesome. And then I meet you and you've got 50 or more and I'm sure it's going to go up every day, double that. So I feel well, not so awesome. But tell me about that. How do you best use what you've earned on The Bachelor, not just the fame, but the social media on how do you use that for professional advancement?

Matt James
There's two things. And one of the things that that I'm not going to lie, that I steal from you is you've got to be creative and you've got to keep what you're presenting funny and current. You know, like there's a million different ways to tell people the same information. And if you're finding a funny way to do it, then like do it. Be bold about how you go about that process, because that's going to keep people coming back for more. And I think you do a great job of it. And it's something that I want to a model going forward from a professional standpoint is just find unconventional ways to be conventional. When you make something digestible for someone who wouldn't necessarily be interested in what you're saying, then that's when the real sparks fly. So just trying to find ways to keep it creative and keep it interesting is my biggest piece of advice.

Spencer Levy 
Well, I think, you know, creative interesting is also a subcategory to keeping it real. Right. Because how do you communicate with anybody that you want to persuade you? You keep it funny. You keep it interesting. You're not just giving information, you're influencing people. And certainly as you have more followers, you're more influential. But it comes back to the basics, entertaining people a little bit while you're giving them information works.

Matt James
And I think that one of our colleagues, two of our colleagues actually that do an incredible job. This is Evan Fiddle. He's a broker in the midtown office that I look forward to his blog post on LinkedIn because he's just extremely talented and a wordsmith. And the way that he crafts his message about what's going on in the economy, what's going on in the commercial real estate world is witty, it's funny and it's digestible. And the same thing with Zac Price, you know, two guys that I really look up to and respect in our space, they have a way of making things that could be extremely overwhelming and difficult to comprehend, very compressed and very happenstance. So, yeah, those two are as well as yourself are people that I try to model that approach after.

Spencer Levy 
So if you were to say to any young professional, and I'll be more specific, you're a young African-American professional, what's the best piece of advice you can give them on why to go into commercial real estate?

Matt James
I can tell them I could start out with the wrong reason. And this is this transcends commercial real estate. This is really anything, I think that the wrong reason to go into not only commercial real estate, but to any job is for the money. There's obviously it's obviously a very lucrative space to be in, and it's not like that for everybody. And the road to getting there is very long, very difficult and very narrow. And along that way, if your only objective is to make money when you're not making it you're going to be very disappointed, you're going to be in a very dark space for a lot of people. I would get into it for the right reasons. You know, if you're going to be serious about the career, you've got to really take that leap of faith and for people, for Black people, for people of color who are looking to get into this space again, it starts with someone like myself sharing my experience and being a resource, being someone that they can lean on and go to for advice. And I try to be that for everybody. You know, any time someone reaches out in college across the country about even if it's something I'm not knowledgeable about, if it's if they're out there wanting to talk about investment sales or wanting to talk about capital markets, then I put them in the right direction. Like, you know, it's a conversation starter because they're like, I want to get into commercial real estate. And then it's like, OK, like what part of commercial real estate? And they're like commercial real estate. It's like, well, I'm in commercial office leasing. Like, there's retail, there's industrial, there's capital markets, there's investment sales, there's advertising, marketing. So it's just like starting that conversation. And then they realize, oh, I didn't realize that there were all these things because someone like myself hasn't had that conversation with them. So it's being extremely conversational and just highlighting things that they wouldn't otherwise have the knowledge of and letting them make that informed decision and support them in any way you can going forward.

Spencer Levy 
Well, I think you serve as a model, not just only as a trailblazer, but the actual structure of your career path is one that I recommended to many. And I think I even recommend it to you when we spoke in the past many times. Start here, go there, how many times I say research is a launching pad because you learn the business, you have this deep grounding and then you could jump from there. So is that part of the advice you give to people as well?

Matt James
A thousand percent, because unless your parents or someone extremely close to you grew up in the business or as a broker or as whatever position that you aspire to be and has this institutional knowledge about it, it's it took me and a lot of you all are way smarter than me. It took me a few years to really grasp the buildings, the market where tenants are trying to be, what competitive rents are. A lot of conversations with my senior broker. So many things factored into. The lowest of baselines in terms of being able to go out and solicit a meeting from my senior broker, that there's no way that I personally would have been ready for it if I hadn't had that year, year and a half, maybe two years of that research experience where you're putting together reports, where you're running the market meetings and you're talking about what happened last year, what's going to happen next year, big deals, how to stack a building, conversations with CoStar, conversations with LoopNet at all these different things that you would never imagine factor into being a good broker are the baseline of what I rely on as an associate who is coming out of a research role.

Spencer Levy 
I've got to ask you one more Bachelor question. Who's going to win? No, I didn't just ask that question. I just wanted to see a reaction to be asking that one more time. But, Matt, I do want to just say any final thoughts how the experience of The Bachelor has shaped you as a person professionally with your charity. Final thoughts that you'd like to share with our listeners.

Matt James
It was just an honor, you know, to be in that position and it just a constant reminder that you represent so much more than yourself. You know, and I'm extremely excited about what's to come. And I live by the words that I have said throughout this This podcast, this interview is I want to be a resource and I encourage you ought to be a resource when we think about change and we think about how to implement it, you might say I don't have the money to do any of this. I don't have the resources like our biggest resources, our time. And if you're willing to give that and really be a part of making that change, then that's the best you can do. And as you donate your time, the next person donate your time. Everyone donates their time. It takes everyone's buy-in to create change. And that's how it's done. So let's do that together.

Spencer Levy 
Great. Let's do that together. That's a great last line. So, Matt, on behalf of The Weekly Take, thank you for being a fantastic guest. Congratulations on your success of The Bachelor. I speak for everybody here at the company. We're so proud of you for what you've done. Thank you for The Weekly Take. Matt James, The Bachelor on The Bachelor.

Matt James
Thank you, Spencer.

Spencer Levy 
For more on our show and on CBRE’s favorite leading man, Matt James, check out CBRE.com/TheWeeklyTake. You can also see a lot more of Matt, of course, by tuning in to ABC for season twenty five of The Bachelor on Mondays at 8 p.m. Eastern. The Weekly Take will be back next week. In the meantime, we'd love to hear your feedback. So whether you found us on Apple podcasts, Spotify or another platform, please subscribe rate and review us wherever you listen. Thanks for joining us. Until next time I'm Spencer Levy. Be smart. Be safe. Be well.